Ep. 8 - Thomas the Apostle

Happy Easter!

After a break for Easter, we're back with a deep dive into Thomas the Apostle, more often known as doubting Thomas. Enjoy!

If you enjoy, subscribe and follow on Instagram for updates!

Keep your heart blazing!

@blazing.hearts.podcast

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:17

Hey guys, welcome to Blazing Hearts Podcast, which we talk about faith and living your life tearfulest. I'm Michael.

SPEAKER_00 0:24

And I'm Emily.

SPEAKER_01 0:26

And today we are doing a deep dive into Thomas the Apostle, who is more often known as doubting Thomas. Thomas, also known as Didimus, which means twin, was a close follower of Jesus, one of the twelve, who was with him throughout Jesus' earthly ministry. He was fiercely loyal to Jesus, which is one of the aspects of Thomas that we'll get into later. He sought clarity in his teachings, especially during the Last Supper. And but he also had his doubts in the resurrection, which is where he gets his name Doubting Thomas from. After Pentecost, it's thought that he went east to India to spread the gospel, where he was martyred in 72 AD. I think that Thomas can sometimes get a really bad rap or like a negative view because he's called Doubting Thomas. I feel like that's one of those things that we like you learn as like a first or second grader. And it's like, and this is Thomas, he doubted Jesus. And I think that's where his story often ends when we're kind of learning about him. So I thought we should do kind of a deep dive into who he is and some of his lines in the gospel.

SPEAKER_00 1:28

One of those places in the gospel where like we see Thomas talking is John 11, 16, which says, So Thomas, called Videmus, said to his fellow disciples, let us also go to die with him.

SPEAKER_01 1:41

So this is what I was talking about when we discussed Thomas being fiercely loyal. This is placed in the larger context of Jesus preparing to enter Jerusalem. And he kind of tells his disciples, like, we need to go back to Jerusalem, or at least near Jerusalem, actually to Bethany for the raising of Lazarus. And all the disciples try to kind of warn him against this because the Jews want to kill Jesus. But Thomas kind of speaks up and is like, okay, that's fine. If he is to die, then we should go and die with him. And I think it's really commendable and kind of speaks to how we should live. If Thomas kind of gave this up for Jesus, then we can kind of give ourselves away in sacrifice and in loyalty to him.

SPEAKER_00 2:25

I think like circling back to what you were saying about how like maybe just see Thomas has like daddy Thomas, something that like my priest will tell me a lot because I'm a very like, I guess curious. I don't know if that's the right word, but like a curious person, and I ask a lot of questions, and I'm like, okay, well, why is it like this? Or blah blah blah, like not because I don't believe it, but I just want to understand. And something that he tells me a lot is that like the doubt is not bad. It's just like what you do with that doubt. So, like in this case, like Thomas, he would question it or he would ask Jesus, like, why is it like this? And I don't think that's like a bad thing. So I don't think that we really should view him only as daddy Thomas, like Michael said.

SPEAKER_01 3:03

So I think one part of Thomas that is really commendable is this kind of loyalty and willingness to go and die with Jesus. And another place where this comes up a lot with all the apostles is during the Last Supper. And Jesus in John's gospel is kind of giving to his disciples and kind of explaining, I'm going to die, but a little hidden behind words and parables. And he says, Where I am going, you cannot go, but you know the way. And Thomas kind of responds with like a deeper, more curious question of like, we don't know where you're going. How do you how do we know the way? Like, this doesn't make sense. Can you explain it? And that like just natural curiosity prompts Jesus to one of the like core verses of John's gospel of I am the way, the truth, and the life. And I think that just natural curiosity is similar to what you were saying of like, I need to know more and I want to learn more.

SPEAKER_00 4:02

So to go along with that, like his natural curiosity. Um, we see in like John chapter 14 how Michael said where Thomas is like, but Lord, like, how do we know how to follow you if like we don't know where you're going? And I think that just like shows one how he is curious and he's like, Well, I want to do like this thing, but like how do I do it? But then also how he like wants to follow the Lord and he's like, Yes, like Lord, I want to go where you're going. But again, like his curiosity of like, but how do I get there? What am I supposed to do along the way? Like, all these things that he doesn't necessarily know, but that show his like curiosity as opposed to maybe his doubting, as like it's more commonly known.

SPEAKER_01 4:43

Yeah. And I think it's also interesting because I feel like we can have a lot of these same doubts in our own lives or like curiosities in our lives where it's like, I really want to do this, I really want to follow you. I just don't know how to do this. Show me how to do this. Yeah. I think that's something that Thomas kind of affirms in this, like, that's okay. Like, you have this great desire, and Jesus kind of responds to this great desire of like, know me, for I am the way, the truth, and the life. And I think that's just this really interesting play of like, okay, you have this desire, then come and get to know me. And I think that can come up in a variety of ways how we actually can get to know Jesus.

SPEAKER_00 5:25

Yeah, that's a really good point. I think there's like a lot of ways that we can do that, and we can like know the Lord. Because, well, let me backtrack a little bit. There's like talks about a lot, I guess, in like youth group, and when you're like getting to know the Lord, you want your heart posture to be the same as the Lord's and like your hearts to be aligned. Because when your hearts are aligned, then you're doing his will, or at least like most likely, so like praying and like asking the Lord, like, Lord, is this what you want me to do? Like asking for his input on things, simply like going to Irish and just being with him, because like the Lord is like our friend and he wants to know us. Well, he does know us, but he wants us to want to know him. So, like talking to him, like I don't know, say I was like talking to Michael and I was like, Oh, I had such a bad day. This thing really bugged me. Like, talking about that, like with the Lord. Yeah. Um, and yeah, just like getting to know his heart better so that you can be more aligned with his will, so that you can better view his like plan for your life.

SPEAKER_01 6:22

Yeah, and I think, you know, a little self-plugged, but we kind of talk about it in our third episode, prayer, of like these ways of like I have this desire to get to know God, but where do I start? And I think one of the most important places to start is getting to know Jesus through prayer. Ums but moving on to kind of the big reason why we started talking about Thomas, good old Downing Thomas. So John 20, 28 is the verse that we're really gonna look at here, but it's 24 through 29 is the whole Downing Thomas story. Thomas called Didymus, one of the twelve, was not with them when Jesus came, and he gets told that you know, we've seen Jesus, he's back. And Thomas kind of has this like doubt or like not unbelief, but like this need and desire for proof. So, unless I see the mark of the nails in his hands, put my finger into the nail marks and put my hand to his side, I will not believe. And so a week passes by, and then Jesus comes again into the upper room and understands and knows Thomas's desire. So, what he does is he allows Thomas to kind of see his wounds in tw John 2028. Thomas' response to this, these wounds, and like the kind of proof in front of him is my Lord and my God. And this is a really interesting and powerful line because it's w it's the fourth to last verse in John's gospel, and it's this and it's the first time the use of the word God, I think it's Theos in Greek, is used to attribute to Jesus. Jesus has been called the Son of God, and in the start of the gospel, it was the word which is understood to be Jesus, the word was God, and the word was with God. So there's kind of these themes that are playing around through John's gospel, and it kind of comes to a head in Thomas in the closing verses, and where he extols Jesus as Lord and God, and kind of Jesus goes on and says, Blessed are those who have not seen and have believed. But I think Thomas's doubts that lead him to this deeper faith are really interesting.

SPEAKER_00 8:44

Yeah, and I just want to like preface by saying, like, like how Michael said, Jesus says, those who have seen or well, those who have not seen and believed, um, like blessed are you. But like that desire for like proof and like like how Thomas was like, No, I like need to see this for it to be like real, is not a bad desire at all. And the Lord doesn't think that. He just says, like, blessed are those who have believed but haven't seen. But yeah, like what Michael said, how Thomas, his like curiosity leads him to further depths of his faith, I think is a very like accurate like statement because like how can you like further understand something? One, if you don't like do any research on it, two if you don't ask questions, if you don't understand, and then like like if you really just don't care. But like I feel like Thomas's doubt shows that he does care, which leads him to ask more questions and then his further understanding of our faith and like Jesus at the time and like the whole everything.

SPEAKER_01 9:42

Yeah. And I think especially with the earlier verses, like it's obvious in the earlier verses that like Thomas has this desire and this want in his soul to follow God and to follow Jesus. And I don't think that's something that would go away in the span of I think it's one week since the Last Supper Discourse, where he's kind of showing this curiosity again. But to have these curiosities that prompt you to deeper faith is really key. And I'm gonna be honest, I didn't really notice that this verse was one of the last ones until I was looking at it just now. But seeing those parallels kind of both from Thomas in the story and also throughout John's gospel are something that's really interesting. So yeah, but I think one of the things that we kind of wanted to do as well was talk about, you know, so we did this dive into Thomas, but also okay, so I don't think maybe some of our listeners will be, but I don't think any of us are gonna be at risk of dying for Jesus. I don't think that many of us are gonna go be martyrs, nor do we not know where Jesus necessarily is. I mean, we know now that Jesus was talking about his dying and then going into heaven for us, but I think it's just how do we apply these verses and scripture from Thomas into our own lives in 2026.

SPEAKER_00 11:12

Yeah, because I feel like it's very very good to take like what is said in the Bible and apply it to our lives, and some ways that I think we can do that are like one die to self. So like I guess challenging yourself and being like, like, for example, if my little brother's like annoying me, I'll be like, If yeah, I'm not gonna say anything, and I'm just gonna like die to myself and just allow him to annoy me and just like move on.

SPEAKER_01 11:38

Yeah, and like I am with Jesus, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:42

Right, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:44

There are ways in which we can still kind of die with Jesus, like you were saying in our day and age, and especially with our culture, obviously some groups are kind of more pro-Christian than others, but a lot of teenage culture can be seen as a little hostile to Christianity and especially Catholicism. So I think one of those ways that we can kind of die with Jesus is just being openly Christian and not being necessarily afraid of embarrassment that you know we might upset some people with what we believe or what we say and kind of just die with Jesus. Like, I mean, in the raising of Lazarus story, especially where we're talking, it's like these people don't like Jesus and they want to they want to get rid of Jesus by killing him. And I think that can be drawn as a parallel to today, where it's like some people may be hostile to Jesus and not want him, and it's just okay, accept that and don't let that discourage you or uh dismay you.

SPEAKER_00 12:58

Right, but I think also just like meet them with like the love that the Lord meets us. Because like at the end of the day, like that is still the Lord's child, and he loves them just as much as he loves us. Yes, and I think just like not being like persistent in like a badgering way, but like persistent in like loving them and showing them through your actions and I guess sometimes words how the Lord is.

SPEAKER_01 13:23

Yes, absolutely. And I'm not saying like you know, be aggressive in evangelization, and that's not really the focus right now, but just like you know, giving yourself up to get not being afraid of failure or of embarrassment. Yeah, kind of putting yourself out there and be a Christian, follow Jesus with like this fervent love.

SPEAKER_00 13:50

Yeah, like live boldly for the Lord.

SPEAKER_01 13:52

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 13:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:53

I think especially for the more doubting Thomas or the curious Thomas aspect of it, is uh to be curious about our faith or about your faith. Because the Catholic Church has so much intricacy and kind of theology about it, where it's okay to be curious and to ask these questions and to go to someone and wonder these because you know it will hopefully draw you into like this deeper faith with Jesus.

SPEAKER_00 14:29

Yeah. And I find that like when I am curious about the faith. Like so much like just like comes to life in my mind about our faith. Like I'll like realize one thing and it's like a burst of color, and like, oh my gosh, can that kind of say this, and then this and this and this. And it's like, whoa, like that was so cool that I didn't even know that like one question could have that effect.

SPEAKER_01 14:50

Yeah, definitely. And I think a lot of our faith is so interconnected that it's actually really cool to kind of step back and look at all of it.

SPEAKER_00 14:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:59

And then obviously doubting Thomas, it's okay to have doubts, it's okay to struggle or to wrestle with the faith. And Thomas kind of affirms that. But what's also so cool about this is this exclamation of my Lord and my God is to you know adore and extol God in whether that be in prayer and getting to know Jesus, but just like recognizing who God is and how God works is so important.

SPEAKER_00 15:29

Yeah, I agree. Because like at the end of the day, like the Lord, He wants to like meet us with love and He wants to like just love us and He wants to be with us. And I think just like everything boiling back down to that fact is just important.

SPEAKER_01 15:43

Yeah, so that's gonna do it for this episode and deep dive into Thomas the Apostle.

SPEAKER_00 15:48

Listen to us wherever you get your pods. Have a blessed day.